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 mournebrake
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3/22/2015 6:41:58 AM reply with quote send message to mournebrake Object to Post

Lots of good points Spyte.

I think you've hit the nail on the head with the problem being being the lack of unity and friendliness. We need chat back. Basics need to be able to access it.

We need more people using the forums - and less people moaning if something appears to be posted in the wrong forum.

This is a competitive game but it shouldn't discourage people from saying something, anything in fact. We should be friendly and helpful.

We all know there are kennels on here (in rarer breeds) that WON'T enter dogs to make majors (unless they are going to take the points).

Why do we have this forum that makes a two tier game even more elitist? Why 'Alpha' forum that basics can't be privvy to? Surely we need need to encourage the basics and include them wherever possible.
 Spyte
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3/22/2015 7:44:11 AM reply with quote send message to Spyte Object to Post

The alpha forum isn't an issue, it's always been part of the game. There has to be perks to being a premium account, and one of them is this forum.
 
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3/22/2015 9:45:50 AM reply with quote send message to Object to Post edit post

What about an app that would make mobile access easier? I have no idea how much it would take to develop such a thing, but that might bring in more people who use their phones or tablets more than a computer.

I think the log in bonus was a great idea-would be nice to hear how it has impacted the game. I know I have been able to show tons of dogs even in the rare breeds, and maintain my kennel balance more or less with it.

Obviously Jeff's emails are bringing in returning players. I came back on the second or third email I was sent, initially just one kennel but got sucked right back in to a family account. Haven't missed a day logging in in 2.5 months!

I personally don't have a problem with the time frame of the game. It does take a while for dogs to grow up and be old enough to breed, but it gives time to session, show and earn titles. I would actually probably be less interested if things moved faster...but I guess it depends on what an individual's goals are. Trying to maintain a balance is part of the challenge for me!

As far as basic accounts go, I do think that what is offered is fair, when you consider that this is a business for Jeff. A basic can get started, try out breeding and some of the other premium perks, and see if they like the game or not before deciding to upgrade. There has to be an advantage for premiums, or nobody would go premium and the site might cease to exist.

I actually do read the forums pretty regularly and respond when I have something to say, but only one of my breeds is forum active. I like the interaction with other players and it is always interesting to see someone else's strategy, but that is not make or break for me staying on this site. I do love that there are people from all over the world on this site, all different age groups and backgrounds, with different interests and goals. It might get really boring if everyone played exactly the way I do.

I have a lot of respect for the folks who are taking the rare breeds, or the color breeding, and working up to current SOPS from source dogs. I think asking for help in the forums for those breeds with few dogs is a good idea, and maybe people who are willing could pick up at least one or two dogs of a rare breed to help out. I don't know about the idea of having source dogs be equivalent to dogs that folks have been working on for years-would people lose the incentive to buy puppies from their fellow breeders if they could get a comparable source dog for less money?




 CirclingSky
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3/22/2015 9:46:39 AM reply with quote send message to CirclingSky Object to Post

That was me!^
 mournebrake
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3/22/2015 10:47:24 AM reply with quote send message to mournebrake Object to Post

This thread is generating a lot of interesting points and people are having their say - all in all good for the game imho.
 KT Kennel
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3/24/2015 4:13:47 AM reply with quote send message to KT Kennel Object to Post

I would say that the biggest issue with the game is the lack of any money making ability. I joined back dec last year, had to stop showing recently because I went into negatives. The returns for showing simply aren't there. Neither are they for myself if I breed as no one buys from the auction.
End of this month my subscription will be cancelled as it is a waste of real money on a game where to be successful you need to buy in extra sessions and feed better food all of which costs money. The log in bonus doesn't cover it but I cannot believe how the site was before that. It is a shame as I like the game, but at the moment it is a waste of time.
 LakePlacid
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3/28/2015 3:43:08 PM reply with quote send message to LakePlacid Object to Post

I see the biggest problems to be getting basics to sign up, without new puppy sales and extra entries too many kennels end up playing by themselves or with one other kennel. The biggest problem is when a basic signs up they buy a few dogs, usually pups. They enter them in shows, but don't have any success due to not being sessioned. It takes 30 days to breed, and they would almost be done with their free breeding time. So someone comes on and signs up. There is almost nothing they can do. Even if they know what to do, it takes 1 min a day to check your kennel. With all the games out there with great graphics, internet on cell phones, it is almost impossible to keep someones interest when for the first month there is almost nothing to do. I was very successful before, left then came back after an Email from Jeff. It still took several months to build my kennel back up to the point where there was a reason to be on every day except for the daily bonus. All you have to do is set up your food, sessions and set up your entries and you are done for awhile. The challenge is to get new people to sign up, then keep a new kennel interested for that first month.
 Spyte
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3/28/2015 3:47:18 PM reply with quote send message to Spyte Object to Post

To me money is not the biggest issue. I show at least 3-8 dogs at any given time, feed custom rations to most puppies, breed to outside studs and am still quite over the comfortable line. It's all about money management. There was a point where I couldn't show more than 2 dogs because I needed to keep funds in my kennel, so I made that decision and also sold sessions if I could. I still sell sessions when possible. Money management is a huge part of the game.
 rhondacline
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3/30/2015 7:19:42 PM reply with quote send message to rhondacline Object to Post

It has always been my personal belief that for every 1 “paying” player we need at least 5 or 6 “non-paying” players. These are the players that buy our puppies and use our stud dogs. PLUS in this day and age, there are too many other games where I can play the same game without paying as the paying players. That’s where some of our lost players have gone and that’s where a lot of our potential players are going. (in my opinion).

If I compare the game to real life, I see subscribers as “professional handlers, established kennel/lines,” we have the room and resources to keep 30 dogs and breed multiple litters. I see non-subscribers as “newbies, owner/handlers, small home based kennels” – limited room and resources – but if you play your cards right you can definitely succeed. BUT in the end, we really need ALL of these people to make the dog show world really shine and grow.

IF it were my game -
I would allow basics almost all of the same privileges of subscribers – except I would limit them to 5 dogs and 1 breeding per month.
They get to really experience the game, they can be competitive in the show ring – and if they have any chance of getting hooked, they are going to get hooked and subscribe. New players = puppies sold / 1 breeding per month = stud fees. I also believe we would see more of our puppies being finished, certainly more competition in the show ring.

I also feel that there should be more “updating”
I work for an internet based business – and basically if you’re not moving forward, you are falling behind. I would love to see some regular updates to the game – they don’t have to be big – just something to show players that “we are invested in the game and continually working to make it better.” To me, that’s the kind of attitude I want to see in a game that wants my money. Maybe there is an ongoing list of “player requested updates” that are voted on and implemented. Maybe it take 2-3+ months to go from “maybe we could” to “implemented and working”, but at least there is something happening. Then when new players come in – it feels like the game is moving forward and they’re going to want to get on board – because this game is awesome and it’s only going to get better!

Anyway, just thinking out loud in response to the post – otherwise known as, my two cents. wink :)
 Synergy Siberians
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3/30/2015 7:37:24 PM reply with quote send message to Synergy Siberians Object to Post

After playing for 8 years and taking 3 off I just opened two new subscribing kennels, happy and sad to see the game has not changed much in addition to the breed graphics. Easy for me to get back in the routine but hard to say what will bring in new members
 Astoria Kennel
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3/30/2015 8:23:17 PM reply with quote send message to Astoria Kennel Object to Post

I've been lurking on this thread to hear out everyone's opinions. I'm not entirely sure what needs to change, but I do realize that something should be done.
My ideas (some are repeats)

-Better/More user friendly FAQ/Help Page for the newbies. In my opinion the Help link at the top of the page isn't enough - there ought to be a FAQ link to the left under Community or Information. I would also like to see the current Help page updated as some things aren't very clear.

-Leave the log in bonus. I think this is happening, but felt it needed to be mentioned. I love this. It encourages people to come back, every. single. day. Not once a week or every 5 days to check on pups, but every day. Realistically, users don't need to be on every day - there are assistants for sessions and you can pre-enter shows. The LB helps keep people here daily.

-Updates and Bug Fixes - there are so many small things in this game that really aren't major issues, but small ones to make the site more user friendly. The 'keep me logged in' feature. Shows not running in a timely manner. All studs available on stud dog pages, even inactive kennels.

-Chat for ALL users, most importantly, basics!! When new people sign up, it is overwhelming, especially if they aren't in the dog show world in RL. the point scale is usually enough to confuse most people. Somewhere where basics can ask simple questions (and most importantly) get quick answers encourages them to stay here. If they don't get the game, post on the forum for help, and don't get replies right away- they'll leave and not come back.

-I also think source dogs should be a bit more realistic. as soon as you open an account, you're prompted to create source dogs. Why should we be encouraging people to create these very low quality dogs? Perhaps a link to the Dogs for Sale instead?

I'm sure Jeff is overwhelmed but I would hate to see the site go under.

T
 Almost Heaven
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3/30/2015 8:27:06 PM reply with quote send message to Almost Heaven Object to Post

this post has been edited 1 time(s)

quote
posted by rhondacline


IF it were my game -
I would allow basics almost all of the same privileges of subscribers – except I would limit them to 5 dogs and 1 breeding per month.

Or why not let them breed but no more than 1 pregnant bitch at a time? As opposed to subscribers 10 at a time. They would still have to decide when the pups were show age to only keep one or two or replace older dogs, but at least they could play more with their own line. There is nothing like the rush of having a homebred champion take points. Let them experience that more often.

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Last edited by Almost Heaven on 3/30/2015 8:28:41 PM
 Almost Heaven
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3/30/2015 8:50:16 PM reply with quote send message to Almost Heaven Object to Post

this post has been edited 1 time(s)

I think the two biggest problems are the vast difference between basic player vs subscribers and between current dogs vs starter dogs, Either one of these issues is enough to chase newbies off in the first week if not the first day.

As far as starter dogs go, those are completely unreasonable. I have said before, getting a starter dog should be like buying a puppy from a breeder who doesn't show dogs professionally. Most of their dogs are going to be quality dogs, but maybe not quite show quality. Maybe occasionally they get a puppy that is star quality out of "pet quality" parents, but not usually. But they are never the big headed, hump backed, warped puppies you get as starter dogs in SD.

I know the current formula assigns random 20s and 0s to the puppy's "pedigree". A better method would be for the AI to compute the current SOP range of the breed, figure the average, then assign a value based off that number with XX% of the pup being within say 10% of that number, a lower percentage of being with 5%, an even lower number of being at that average and a minuscule chance that it will be higher than the average. Does that make sense? At least then a newbie would occasionally get a dog that can compete or even win once in a while, it might keep them from getting discouraged and leaving.

And I have no idea the formula for purchasing starter dogs after your free ones, but I have seen them selling for over $1000! Its bad enough that figure is 10x the normal selling price of even quality pups bred in the game, add in that the quality is 1/10th of the breed sop and there is no way that dog is worth it. I would love to bring back certain colors in some of my breeds. But I cant afford to "order" a specific color and then spend months introducing that into my line.

Just my two cents. But I think the whole starter dog thing needs to be reworked.

PS I would get that average only from active dogs that are actively being bred and/or shown or the numbers are going to be pulled way way down by all the abandoned starter dogs in all those kennels,

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Last edited by Almost Heaven on 3/30/2015 8:58:52 PM
 King Blazzo Kennels
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3/30/2015 8:57:25 PM reply with quote send message to King Blazzo Kennels Object to Post

i think the name starter dog alone is confusing for new players. I remember when i started it seemed like you HAD to start with those dogs.
 Almost Heaven
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3/30/2015 9:01:13 PM reply with quote send message to Almost Heaven Object to Post

this post has been edited 1 time(s)

quote
posted by King Blazzo Kennels
i think the name starter dog alone is confusing for new players. I remember when i started it seemed like you HAD to start with those dogs.
Exactly! Maybe do away with the "Free starter dogs" and direct them to the dogs for sale link like someone else suggested. Keep the "buy source dogs" option available for people who want new blood/colors etc

ETA I am sure it is very disheartening for a newbie to get all excited about HIS dogs, picking the perfect names for them etc only to find out that they are basically worthless.

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Last edited by Almost Heaven on 3/30/2015 9:02:50 PM
 rhondacline
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3/30/2015 9:16:54 PM reply with quote send message to rhondacline Object to Post

this post has been edited 1 time(s)

quote
posted by Almost Heaven
quote
posted by King Blazzo Kennels
i think the name starter dog alone is confusing for new players. I remember when i started it seemed like you HAD to start with those dogs.
Exactly! Maybe do away with the "Free starter dogs" and direct them to the dogs for sale link like someone else suggested. Keep the "buy source dogs" option available for people who want new blood/colors etc




I can certainly see this as a workable option - and it's win-win.

New players end up with a puppy that can compete in the ring (plus they could also get a friendly note from the breeder offering help to the new player if needed)

Existing players get some needed $$ - plus I know we would all rather have puppies sold and in the show ring than FHed.

Now that we can purchase starter dogs for source breeding projects/color projects/or breeds that have 'disappeared' - to me it only makes sense to have new players purchase from existing lines instead of dogs that in almost all cases are useless to a new player.

The only 'snag' would be players who come in that are interested in a breed that has no puppies for sale or a breed with no players - so players may need to also be directed to the Breed Directory pages also.

I like it!

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Last edited by rhondacline on 3/30/2015 9:17:44 PM
 King Blazzo Kennels
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4/1/2015 12:40:54 AM reply with quote send message to King Blazzo Kennels Object to Post

quote
posted by Almost Heaven
quote
posted by King Blazzo Kennels
i think the name starter dog alone is confusing for new players. I remember when i started it seemed like you HAD to start with those dogs.
Exactly! Maybe do away with the "Free starter dogs" and direct them to the dogs for sale link like someone else suggested. Keep the "buy source dogs" option available for people who want new blood/colors etc

ETA I am sure it is very disheartening for a newbie to get all excited about HIS dogs, picking the perfect names for them etc only to find out that they are basically worthless.

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Last edited by Almost Heaven on 3/30/2015 9:02:50 PM

yeah i hate when someone asks for help and you have to start by saying ok see everything you've done?.......... throw it in the t can and start over.
 speedy2
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4/6/2015 7:41:42 PM reply with quote send message to speedy2 Object to Post

What about an extra class each show for kennels with less than 3 months showdogtime. All Breeds. Gives these newbies a chance of winning, and learning about sessioning.

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Did you know?
The third obedience title is a UD, or "Utility Dog", which is earned through competition in the Utility obedience class