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I would love to have this as an option in a few of my breeds. It is available in real life, for about $65...

www.vgl.ucdavis.edu/services/coatcolordog.php

I would be happy to pay to see the color genetics..

I doubt this would be implemented since it is part of the challenge of the game to work it out yourself

All the color/coat genetics are listed on the breed page- most you can figure out with a few breedings.

This is one of those 'paid' services on many of the other games I play. You can either work it out on your own - or pay real money to get a "gene test"

I wouldn't have a problem seeing this offered as a paid service.

(Edited to add - Maybe $1-$3 for the test per dog)








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Last edited by rhondacline on 5/10/2015 8:41:09 AM

The DNA typing is an interesting idea. I wonder if some SD computer wizard out there could make some sweet off site formula to use. Kind of like the SOP site on Showhorse.com.

That having been said and as I used to breed and show Bull Terriers in RL back in the day (90's), I concentrate more about what the SOPs are and how I can improve my own show stock. I personally don't care about what color the puppies are going to be.

(Edited to say: Please don't take offence at my opinions - I'm just a grumpy Ol' lady, k?)


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Last edited by Little Titan Kennels on 5/10/2015 9:53:24 AM

I breed and show whippets in real life, and structure/type/health are much more important than color. My main point is that it is available in real life, why not make it available for a price here as well.

Color genetics are my specialty, the main problem is finding the lost genes (if they exist) in current sop stock. We have over 30 color possibilities in Whippets and Borzoi... But because colors were added late, almost all of them have been lost. I have looked through all abandoned kennels and messages breeders that were active through last year.. No responses.

I am working colors back to show sop, and trying to bring certain traits with them ideally. It would just be helpful to see if all the genes are lost, or just hiding under strong dominant genes.

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posted by Sombra Kennels
All the color/coat genetics are listed on the breed page- most you can figure out with a few breedings.

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In whippets it would take a while, as the current sop dogs are all pretty much heterozygous for dominant traits that will hide all the recessive genes that are lost that you are trying to bring forward.

It would take months to figure out you just wasted your time.

In borzoi, at least the color that is current is recessive...that makes it so much easier.

Ps... The color possibilities for whippets are crazy... It would take more than just a few breedings... There are about 20 possibilities with just solid blue or black.. It can mask anything.

www.showdog.com/breeds/genetics.aspx?breed=Whippet

I would be happy to pay showdog money or even real money to have a chance to look at their genetics. On show rabbit they have/had the genetics listed under the color... Why not offer a way to "test" for certain genes (not necessarily all of them) for a price. It offers no advantage to those showing their dogs.. Just a realist thing to offer and a potential way for Showdog to make more money.

If I had Goldens or labs, obviously it would not be needed... But

Totally agree with this! I have spent many hours plotting out the genetics of my Chihuahua lines, but there are still certain recessive genes that would take you months of wasted breedings to determine if they're even there or not. I've got mine spelled out as far as I can, and I'm still mostly guessing with each breeding. I have many dogs with rare, recessive colors that I simply cannot increase in SOP for love or money, because I can't determine which higher SOP dogs might be hiding the genes I need.

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posted by Keaira
Totally agree with this! I have spent many hours plotting out the genetics of my Chihuahua lines, but there are still certain recessive genes that would take you months of wasted breedings to determine if they're even there or not. I've got mine spelled out as far as I can, and I'm still mostly guessing with each breeding. I have many dogs with rare, recessive colors that I simply cannot increase in SOP for love or money, because I can't determine which higher SOP dogs might be hiding the genes I need.

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Wow - That has GOT to be more than frustrating. Do you know why the SOPs on rare colors don't go up? Is it something Jeff put in the game, say like blue dobermans that have health problems or "lethal white gene" in Paint horses?

I wouldn't mind if this gets implemented, I personally wouldn't use it, but I can't see the harm in it. While it is true that it dumb down the strategy in color breeding a little, color breeding doesn't effect anything anyway; it's purely cosmetic. I'd be all for people having things like this that can make the game a bit more enjoyable to them, may even attract more people to certain breeds, who knows.

At any rate, it's not unrealistic so why not?

I think this would be a good idea. Like Keaira I am color breeding as well on my kennel, Igraine. German Shepherds have a ton of colors (I am trying to get them all to showable SOPs) and this tool would be very helpful.

Little Titan - the problem is that these particular colors (any Chocolate pattern) are recessive, so when you breed to a higher SOP with a dominant color, it hides the recessive every time. Then you *hope* the higher SOP pup you keep also carries the recessive, wait for it to get to be breeding age, then breed it onto another Chocolate, and *hope* you hit the jackpot with the right recessive combo. I've been working on this for literally almost a year IRL, and my Chocolate lines are still nowhere essentially. I've made good progress in all of my other color projects, but this one is going to be the death of me. >.<

Keaira- any pup out of a dominant/recessive breeding on the chocolate locus WILL carry the recessive- there's nothing on that locus more recessive than b. So there's no hoping. Breeding a carrier to a carrier will generally get you chocolate pups eventually. It takes longer to raise recessive traits but it's hardly impossible. I haven't looked at your genetics specifically but it may be you need to isolate out other recessives to make this easier on you.

To the original question- I'd be ok with tests since they are available in real life- but I'm not ok with it being "too easy". Like in real life, the tests should be a bit expensive, and only reveal one gene on one dog. You should not get the whole genome or be able to see it for all the dogs in your kennel- that's not how it works in real life, and it shouldn't work here. While color currently plays no part in the game, it hasn't been ruled out that it never will. And it is part of the extra challenge- the skill and puzzle of it add to the game.

I'm not really colour breeding with any intensity any more although I still track the genetics in a couple of my breeds. I agree, it is a lot of work.

I used test breedings to help determine who might be carrying those illusive recessives. You need to keep a male and a female that is pure for the recessive - it doesn't matter how bad they are. When they get old, breed them together and you have a whole litter that you know is pure for the recessive.

When you get a nice dog that you think might carry the recessive, you breed it to the known (pure) recessive and if you get one pup that shows the recessive you then know that better 'maybe' carrier does in fact carry.

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posted by Lilliput
To the original question- I'd be ok with tests since they are available in real life- but I'm not ok with it being "too easy". Like in real life, the tests should be a bit expensive, and only reveal one gene on one dog. You should not get the whole genome or be able to see it for all the dogs in your kennel- that's not how it works in real life, and it shouldn't work here. While color currently plays no part in the game, it hasn't been ruled out that it never will. And it is part of the extra challenge- the skill and puzzle of it add to the game.

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I agree with it not being too easy... And an expensive one gene test (as it is in real life) is what I intended for this to be. It would require strategy... As you are spending a lot of money on one test, that may or may not work out in your favor.

I would not be against adding this to the game. I do agree that should it be added that it is done as has been suggested - one dog, one gene, one charge which should not be too low.

I do hesitate to add this fee as a real dollar item at this time. I have been playing ShowRabbit for almost a year, figuring out the pros and cons (and there are both) to a real dollar based economy. I would not want to see SD converted to the same model though I am sort of open to a mixed format but I'm not yet sure how that would work.

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posted by GaylanStudio9
I would not be against adding this to the game. I do agree that should it be added that it is done as has been suggested - one dog, one gene, one charge which should not be too low.

I do hesitate to add this fee as a real dollar item at this time. I have been playing ShowRabbit for almost a year, figuring out the pros and cons (and there are both) to a real dollar based economy. I would not want to see SD converted to the same model though I am sort of open to a mixed format but I'm not yet sure how that would work.

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Maybe offer both? A way to pay either with real money, or SD money... Most color breeders lose much more money than they earn, and some only have SD money to work with.

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posted by SKYY Whippets
Maybe offer both? A way to pay either with real money, or SD money... Most color breeders lose much more money than they earn, and some only have SD money to work with.

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I'm also against real money. SD money is scarce, as well it should be, and everyone is on a fairly level playing field. the SD money cost should be such as to make players use this feature sparingly. It should not be easy to test all the dogs in your kennel for all genes, or even one dog for all genes. This should be a rare tool where you have to weight the convenience, but cost of the test versus the time of doing some test breedings or just not knowing for sure, all against exactly how badly you need to know that particular gene on that particular dog.

I'm "fortunate" that in my color project in Mudis, I was trying to get back the dominant color, since pretty much the only thing that was left were all recessives (ash and ashbrown) and merles of those. The good thing is that I had some VERY old dogs in an old kennel that weren't show quality by an means, but they were black and brown. Some other Mudi kennels had a black boy they put up for stud for me to use too, and that helped since they were higher SOP than what I had. It hasn't taken TOO long to get my dogs to show quality SOP, but I am being careful to never breed a dilute to a dilute to not risk getting back to the point where we lose the dominant colors. Of course, several times the best pup in the litter (by far!) is a dilute! I'm not sure I'd use the ability to test for color on the game (except maybe to see what the fawn or white dogs are masking), but I certainly have used it on my RL Mudis.