.com Forum · Neapolitan Mastiff
Replies in this thread : 6
| Author | Topic : color help | |||
| kmr kennels Basic User Posts : 1,000+  |
this post has been edited 5 time(s) Saw Crow's post in Alpha, so did some research for you.
Neo color genes are quite hard to track down, this is what I found. May not be accurate if I got the dominant genes wrong, going off that black is dominant over mahogany. ETA: changing code from 'As' & 'Ay' to using the standard 'B' for black and 'b' for Mahogany, after reading PPvalhund's posting, and for simplicity.  From what I found, Grey is expressed when Black is diluted with 'd' locus(standard dilution gene, makes black dogs into blue), same rule as most other breeds. Mahogany, when diluted by 'd', is what creates the Tawny color. Dog must carry both the 'd' gene and 'b' gene to produce tawny when mated to another 'd' and 'b' carrier. Tawny is what is also known as Fawn or Isabelle in some other breeds. Brindle can be in all colors. Did not code the White locus 'S' in for simplicity, but the rule for it is written below if you want it. Hope it works for you. Gene rules below(again, may be incorrect due to incorrect gene info, but should work correctly for SD, all the same lol), then list of possible colors: BB...Black Bb...Black, carries mahogany bb...Mahogany (aka brown/red/liver/chocolate in other breeds) EE.......no brindle EEbr.....carries brindle EbrEbr...brindle DD..Normal Black or Mahogany Dd..Normal, carries blue(aka Grey or Tawny, depending on 'B' gene) dd..Diluted (Grey or Tawny, depends on 'B' gene) 8 colors with brindling. Want more variety? Add white(chest/belly/etc), makes 16 colors if Solids and Brindles are both possible with White. SS....no white SSi...carries white sisi..white Black BBDDEE.....Black (pure) BBDdEE.....Black, carries Dilute BbDDEE.....Black, carries Mahogany BbDdEE.....Black, carries Mahogany, Dilute(can produce tawny) Black (hidden carrier=do not 'label' or name as 'hidden' or such, just 'Black' as above) Carries brindle genes-Jeff, these are visual Black as above, but separated them from Black so that the brindle gene percentage can be controlled as the breeders decide. BBDDEEbr...Black, carries Brindle BBDdEEbr...Black, carries Dilute, Brindle BbDDEEbr...Black, carries Mahogany, brindle BbDdEEbr...Black, carries Mahogany, brindle, Dilute(can produce tawny) Black Brindle BBDDEbrEbr...Black Brindle BBDdEbrEbr...Black Brindle, carries Dilute BbDDEbrEbr...Black Brindle, carries Mahogany BbDdEbrEbr...Black Brindle, carries Mahogany, Dilute(tawny producer) Grey BBddEE.....Grey BbddEE.....Grey, carries Mahogany(can produce tawny) Grey {hidden brindle carrier) BBddEEbr...Grey, carries Brindle BbddEEbr...Grey, carries Mahogany, Brindle(can produce tawny) Grey Brindle BBddEbrEbr...Grey Brindle BbddEbrEbr...Grey Brindle, carries Mahogany(tawny producer) Mahogany bbDDEE.....Mahogany bbDdEE.....Mahogany, carries Dilute(can produce tawny) Mahogany (hidden brindle carrier) bbDDEEbr...Mahogany, carries Brindle bbDdEEbr...Mahogany, carries Brindle, Dilute(can produce tawny) Mahogany Brindle bbDDEbrEbr...Mahogany Brindle bbDdEbrEbr...Mahogany Brindle, carries Dilute(tawny producer) Tawny bbddEE.....Tawny (genetically is called a Dilute Mahogany) Tawny (hidden brindle carrier) bbddEEbr...Tawny, carries brindle Tawny Brindle bbddEbrEbr...Tawny Brindle ETA to separate the brindle carriers from the main color groups, as suggested below. |
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| Crow2008 Basic User Posts : 1,000+ |
Thank you so much... I don't think we need the white on chest, etc... Simple is the way Jeff wants to go, so we will go with what you said. I don't think it needs to be EXACTLY as in real life, but since all breeds are adding colors, then I thought maybe we should get something started.. Thank you so much, you don't know how much I apreciate it. |
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| Crow2008 Basic User Posts : 1,000+ |
if anybody else in the breed can post here and agree or disagree, that would be great. If you disagree, please add why and what we can do to fix it... Also we need percentages of each color... I propose: black 40% blue 30% mahogany 20% tawny 10% but then I started thinking about the brindles.. all colors can have brindle, so we have to put the percentages for those too? will find out later gotta go now, lol.. thanks |
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| kmr kennels Basic User Posts : 1,000+ |
Brindles: All your colors already carry the potential to create brindle. If you don't want to actually START any dogs out as visual brindle, you don't need to...as the genes can already potentially make brindle. If you start dogs as both color, and brindle, keep in mind your chances for dogs to be visual brindle WILL go up, as that will increase the amount of total dogs carrying brindle genes. Brindle carriers, going off of all potential combos of your main colors, would be 50% of your starting population(Stressing: they are carriers, not visual brindle). If you would like the chances for brindle being smaller, I can work out your color groups like this: Black Black (will be named as Black, just the same as the 'pure' form black above, but carry brindle gene, separated from non brindle carrying black to submit as a percentage to Jeff). Black Brindle (visual brindle) Blue Blue (carrier) Blue Brindle (visual brindle) etc.. So...then what you do is decide on percentage of 'solid' dogs are the greatest, and how many visual brindles you want, and how many brindle carriers you want. For all purposes, the solid dogs that carry brindle will be identical to 'pure' solid dogs, so that the only way you know if they carry brindle is by checking your pedigrees, or by test breeding, or by 'surprise' litters Using your percentage suggestion above, so that 25%(random number, change as you want) of population of each color can carry the genes for, or can be visually be, brindle, divided over your standard colors. This does not mean 25% of TOTAL population are brindle or carries, just 25% of each group are carriers. 30 Black 5 Black (hidden carrier, named as Black) 5 Black Brindle 40% Black dogs, with 10% of TOTAL population are Black with brindle genes, either as visual or carriers. 23 Blue 3.5 Blue (hidden carrier) 3.5 Blue Brindle 30% Blue dogs, with 7% of TOTAL population are Blue with brindle genes, either visual or carriers. 15 Mahogany 2.5 Mahogany (hidden carrier) 2.5 Mahogany Brindle 20% mahogany dogs, with 5% of TOTAL population are Mahogany with brindle genes, either visual or carriers. 7.5 Tawny 1.25 Tawny (hidden carrier) 1.25 Tawny Brindle 10% Tawny dogs, with 2.5% of TOTAL population are Tawny with brindle genes, either visual or carriers. I hope I laid this out in a way that makes sense. If you decide what percentage to start out brindles, I can substitute whatever you need. |
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| Crow2008 Basic User Posts : 1,000+ |
I absolutely love the way you laid it out.. as far as I am concerned, this is the way to go.. thanks you so much |
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| Xentra Basic User Posts : 26 |
Bump - for my topics |
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| Barkingmad95 Basic User Posts : 1 |
So if I have a female neopoliton who is grey/blue Wich carry’s the fawn gene, and a male grey/blue who carry’s the fawn gene, This is possible to get a fawn out of there litter, more likely? I’m nee to neos so not sure on there colours etc If male is just stud dog is he likely to throw a fawn? |
8/1/2008 4:05:14 AM
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Replies in this thread : 6 Post Reply |
